Episodes / Inaugural Season / 16
Episode 16 · Commentary

Is AI Really Going to Kill Us All?

Eli AmdurInaugural season~15 min

About this episode

Dario Amodei, CEO of Anthropic, recently warned that artificial intelligence could eliminate humanity within the next decade, and newsrooms around the world lit up. Eli Amdur's answer: this is not news. The idea is nearly one hundred years old, and it should surprise no one who has been paying attention.

Eli traces the warning back through Isaac Asimov's Three Laws of Robotics and the zeroth law he later placed above them, then to the June 1968 weekend he saw 2001: A Space Odyssey in New York. A lifelong optimist, he asks the hard question: when the stakes are this high, who will be the first to slow down?

The episode closes with great minds on the possible and the impossible, from Asimov, Arthur C. Clarke, M.C. Escher, Ray Bradbury and Philip K. Dick, plus three of Eli's aphorisms on ignorance, courage and solving problems. This episode is brought to you by Kardam Consulting, specialized advisors to the companies that make our medicine.

In this episode

  • Why Dario Amodei's warning that AI could end humanity is a nearly century-old idea
  • Isaac Asimov's Three Laws of Robotics, and the zeroth law that changed one word
  • 2001: A Space Odyssey, HAL and Dave, and the moment we all feared
  • Greed versus altruism: who will be the first CEO or head of state to slow down?
  • Churchill: the longer you can look back, the farther you can look forward
  • Great minds: Asimov, Arthur C. Clarke, M.C. Escher, Ray Bradbury and Philip K. Dick
  • Three aphorisms, ending on: don't avoid problems, solve them

Eli’s Aphorisms

We make tremendous strides when we do two things: admit ignorance and ask questions.
When you see someone with a successful career, you're seeing someone who wasn't afraid to make a bold, courageous decision somewhere along the line.
Don't avoid problems, solve them.

From Great Minds

“I do not fear computers. I fear the lack of them.”
Isaac Asimov
“The only way to discover the limits of the possible is to go beyond them into the impossible.”
Arthur C. Clarke
“Only those who attempt the absurd can achieve the impossible.”
M.C. Escher
“You don't have to burn books to destroy a culture. Just get people to stop reading them.”
Ray Bradbury
“Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.”
Philip K. Dick

Transcript

This is Vantage Point, the podcast for critical thinkers, where we make sense of and excel in our lives, our jobs, and our world. We're not political, just critical.

Often, we find ourselves dealing with two thoughts at one time, a conflict, if you will, that can lead to unproductive, competitive turbulence without resolution.

Sometimes, though, a powerful new force arises, a gestalt.

But even more rarely than that, although with surety, we surpass all of that, and a thought conflict becomes a thought confluence.

Today, we're at one of those rare times where high-tech and high-touch intersect, where we ask ourselves, is AI really going to kill us all?

Read the full transcript

Dario Amodei, the CEO of AI giant Anthropic, along with a growing number of leading CEOs in the field, set newsrooms around the world all abuzz with his statement last week that within the next decade, AI could kill us all, eliminate humanity.

Yep, that'll make the news, all right. But what if I told you that idea is not news?

That idea is nearly 100 years old.

It is. almost 100 years old, and it shouldn't be a surprise to anyone who's been paying attention.

So later on, I'll tell you what some of the great minds in science and science fiction and technology had to say about the subject at hand.

And then remind me to tell you what Winston Churchill said that should affect our thinking just as much.

Talking about great minds in science fiction.

Isaac Asimov, one of the most profound and prolific science fiction writers who ever lived, he wrote or edited more than 500 books.

Introduced in his 1942 story, Runaround, his towering three laws of robotics that he later included in his now classic 1950 collection, I, Robot.

Obey the orders given it by human beings, except where such orders could conflict with the first law.

And the third law of robotics, a robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the first or second law.

Notice the carefully crafted dance of phrases. It's elegant. It's just elegant, smooth, unassailable. Then years later in 1985, Asimov added his zeroth law of robotics. The zeroth or fourth law states, a robot may not injure humanity or through inaction allow humanity to come to harm. How prescient was that?

One word was changed from a human being to humanity, thereby elevating the stature of the three, now four, laws of robotics.

When Asimov added that to his laws, he placed it hierarchically above the original three laws.

Asimov's four laws are in order, the zeroth law, and then the first, second, and third law.

Very clear, very compelling, very commanding.

Something tells me that Amodei has read Asimov to hold those thoughts did you ever see the movie 2001: A Space Odyssey it came out the first weekend of June of 1968 I was getting set to graduate FDU and had nothing to do but get ready for the parties.

When a few of us went to see a movie in New York City, that movie was called 2001: A Space Odyssey. Well, that weekend changed my life. That movie, in my humble opinion, was the most prescient and most important movie ever made.

Here it is, more than a half a century later, and it still is.

So much of what we are now experiencing or have experienced with AI is right there on that movie's screen of the same name, more than three quarters of a century before its time. But it took the on equal genius and creativity of director Stanley Kubrick to make us see it.

So leading up to my seeing that movie in June of 1968 were the powerful intellectual and creative forces of Isaac Asimov, Arthur C. Clarke, and Stanley Kubrick.

That's like the first class of the Baseball Hall of Fame with Ty Cobb and Babe Ruth. Come on.

Outstanding among all the scenes in that movie is this famous scene between Hal, the computer, and Dave, the human, which took an agonizingly long time during the deliberately slow-paced film where that moment we all feared, AI overtaking us had arrived this is where Amodei jumps in and he's scaring the hell out of an awful lot of people I hold those thoughts again I'm an optimist usually in fact on the optimist scale no matter what the issue you usually find me with scores of nine and a half or unabashed tens.

I guess that kind of explains my New York Mets hat.

True to my character, when I was a kid and beyond, people who knew me used to say that I was the kid who would come downstairs on Christmas morning, see my Christmas stocking filled with horse manure, and gleefully ask, where's the pony? But this time, the stakes are so high, and the players so powerful that the greed factor may overcome altruism at any step of the game.

Amodei is right in calling for slowing down the rate of acceleration within AI.

That's all. Just simple. But ask yourself, would you be the first CEO or head of state bad guy to do it? Or would you wait until some other fool does so you'll be the second?

How would you answer to your stockholders If you did either one In today's supercharged global climate Go ahead and place your bets on that one But keep your blood pressure medication nearby Who's going to be first Or will we not be smart enough And sensible enough To listen to Amodei Oh, and I mentioned Winston Churchill before He used to advise The longer you can look back The farther you can look forward In this case Look back to Asimov And ahead to Amadé Life is really simple It's never easy But it's simple Let's take a break I'll be back after this word from one of our sponsors.

Here is a word about a sponsor I am proud to have behind this show.

Kardam Consulting advises the companies that make our medicine. Every pill on the pharmacy shelf is the end of thousands of quiet decisions about chemistry, cost, capacity, and risk. That is where they do their work, which products to develop, which portfolios to keep, and how a supply chain should run. My friend George founded the firm after more than 35 years of global pharmaceutical leadership.

Churchill had it right the longer you can look back, the farther you can look forward. George also mentors pharmaceutical executives and managers, which, if you ask me, is teaching by another name. If your company makes medicine or means to, Kardam Consulting is the counsel you call before the big decisions, not after them. you will find them at kardamconsulting.com my thanks to George and his whole team for supporting Vantage Point let me give you in an order not usually done here, first some thoughts from great minds that either are directly right smack in the middle of this issue or tangential to them and of all people, let's start off with Isaac Asimov who said, I do not fear computers I fear the lack of them and Arthur C.

Clarke the only way to discover the limits of the possible is to go beyond them into the impossible now, getting away from science fiction for a second but let me get into the world of art and give you a thought from M.C. Escher, the great Dutch surrealist and graphic artist who said only those who attempt the absurd can achieve the impossible who considers this absurd? everybody else who didn't think of it to begin with the one person who did doesn't think it's absurd only those who attempt the absurd can achieve the impossible possible.

Let's get back into science fiction for a second. Ray Bradbury, who grew up lacking material goods. He and his family were not wealthy enough to afford computers or technology and couldn't afford to go to college. And so what he did after high school He went to the public library every day and sat down and read books until he became Ray Bradbury.

Ray Bradbury, who also gave credit to libraries for saying that the public library system raised him, said, you don't have to burn books to destroy our culture. Just get people to stop reading them.

Now we've addressed that issue here before and most certainly will again but that's where ideas are found and Philip K. Dick who said that reality is that which when you stop believing in it doesn't go away i think i'm a day gets that and i think what i'd like to do is finish up with my aphorisms.

Aphorism number one, we make tremendous strides when we do two things, admit ignorance and ask questions.

Aphorism number two, when you see someone with a successful career, you're seeing someone who wasn't afraid to make a bold, courageous decision somewhere along the line.

And the last effort of the day, and leading into my sign-off, don't avoid problems, solve them.

That does it for me today, my friends. Thank you for coming and listening. Thank you for being part of this journey. Don't forget to like and share. If you like it, share it. We'll see you in a few days. In the meantime, thanks again. I'm Eli Amdur. See you next time. Until then, keep questioning, keep learning, and keep thinking critically.

Transcript auto-generated from the episode audio and lightly edited for readability.

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